Message-ID: <alt-support-depression/An-ASD-Sampler/part2_971342731@rtfm.mit.edu> Supersedes: <alt-support-depression/An-ASD-Sampler/part2_970064374@rtfm.mit.edu> Expires: 9 Nov 2000 09:25:31 GMT References: <alt-support-depression/An-ASD-Sampler/part1_971342731@rtfm.mit.edu> X-Last-Updated: 1999/03/30 Subject: An alt.support.depression Sampler - part 2 of 3 Followup-To: alt.support.depression,poster Summary: This is a list of posts that I personally consider to be a small "sample" of alt.support.depression (ASD). From: metaphor@usaor.net (Stewart/sna) Organization: here @ home Newsgroups: alt.support.depression,alt.answers,news.answers Date: 12 Oct 2000 09:27:14 GMT X-Trace: dreaderd 971342834 5711 18.181.0.29 Archive-name: alt-support-depression/An-ASD-Sampler/part2 Posting-Frequency: bi-weekly Last-modified: 1999/3/29 Maintainer: Stewart/sna <metaphor@usaor.net> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ An alt.support.depression Sampler, part 2 of 3 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ spider <anon-12390@anon.twwells.com> wrote: Everything I say is so stupid, trite, and unhelpful. All I can do is say; "sorry you feel that way, here's some hugs". Hugs are good, Karent The Hugmaster knows that, but it's just so little, so stupid. I'm sorry here. I'm going to act like a child & whine; Do my posts make ANYBODY feel any better? Or should I just be quiet? I'm feeling really down and tense. Hubby is away for the week at a convention - every day I'm slipping lower and lower. Actually in a way it's kinda nice him not being here - one less body bugging me, but I'm lonely. SEE! I can't be happy either way! When he's here I get annoyed with him for not just letting me vege, but when he's not here I get lonely and slip down. I hate this shit. I hate my life. Sometimes I even hate this stupid newsgroup - takes up so much of my time. Sorry for all the ranting and whining <casey8899@aol.com> wrote: This is my first post after some time of just lurking and trying to figure out this newsgroup. Can't really say I have succeeded in the latter yet. What I am wondering is this: where does one find support? After years of appearing normal while dying inside I have a circle of friends and relatives and coworkers who do not know that I am depressed. I have kept up appearances for work and family. But now I am tired, I am lonely, and I wish I had somebody to just share with, someone who understands but doesn't think he has to fix things. arbra <arbra@eastky.com> wrote with all good intentions: Here is a scripture that may benefit you as it has me: "Have not I commanded thee? Be strong and of good courage. Be not afraid, neither be thou dismayed. For the LORD thy God is with thee whithersoever thou goest." (King James Version, Joshua 1:9) Pattybear <patty83753@aol.com> wrote in response: I actually do believe that God has helped me in my life. But for those of us with a chemical depression requiring medication, our belief in God is simply not enough. We have an illness, NOT necessarily a lack of faith. Christopher Wells <zchald4@ucl.ac.uk> wrote: Does anyone else feel like slapping a therapist who says; "and how do you *feel* about that?" Alan Harding <Alan@harding.demon.co.uk> responded with: There can only be so many polite variations of; "Will you stop blathering on and on about all this tosh as though it mattered! We are here to talk about your feelings, moods, and emotions. It's your reactions to this stuff that I need, not who did what to whom and with which garden implement. If you don't tell me what's going on inside you, then I'll have to poke you in the squidgy bits with a cattle prod every so often. <BbzZzt!>". I suspect they learn not to use *that* approach too often. sara <sarawriter@hotmail.com> wrote: Hi, I'm new here. Ummm, I get depressed sometimes. I'm in high school. I love reading all your posts. Guess I read too many of them. Really gotta go. I'll talk more tomorrow. river rat responded with: Welcome Sara. I'm new here too. Keep posting and let us know if you're okay. I had my first depressive episode at age 15 in the 10th grade, but nobody knew what was going on. If you stay down for more than a couple of weeks at a time, maybe you should talk to somebody who has good information and who can help. You know, I think I read too many of these ASD posts too. orcan <orcan@worldnet.att.net> wrote with self-depreciating humor: I would like to express my deepest and most grateful thanks to ASD. I had intended to write to each of you personally. However, in another stunning display of catatonic tapioca brain, I managed to delete my entire list of messages. <mattsspot@worldnet.att.net> wrote: I am befuddled as to how everyone discusses their depression on the Internet. How do you go to or begin counseling when you are uncomfortable talking about anything pertaining to yourself, especially your depression? Everything is so complicated. dawn <marcel@commonlink.com> responded with: I can relate to that uncanny fear of trying to speak of feelings to someone who is right there physically, looking at you. If you are like me you can feel their eyes boring right through your soul. That very soul which you have taken great measures to protect and keep to yourself. I thought that your post to ASD was a tremendous start. I have found great power in the act of writing. I don't understand it myself, but this is the best outlet I have. Somehow that needed distance is there, and it provides safety to me. You could check and see if there is a therapist who would be willing to do some writing therapy with you. My therapist of a few years back did, and after a time that made it easier (I said easier, not easy) to see her in her office. CupOJoe <anon-10917@anon.twwells.com> wrote: Out of time concerns, I have to delete more messages than I can read. I just dip my hands into the stream of messages, scoop them into my cupped palms, and toss them into the air where they they break into a thousand droplets reflecting the glittering rays of the sun. I read as many as I can before they fall back into the river trickling at my feet. Kristen Jones <kjones@mbcnet.com> wrote: I want your personal story about how the Internet has become a valuable source of information and/or support regarding your medical condition/disease. The information will be used to help illustrate the Internet's potential for those seeking information and/or support. Please help others realize the value of the web as a communications tool by sharing your story. John Timothy <johntim@ix.netcom.com> wrote in response: It was a dark and stormy night. A few of us emotionally unstable ASD'ers were sitting in a car, debating what to do with the woman we had just kidnapped. Her muffled screams from the trunk were making it even harder than usual to concentrate. It had all started when we got ONE MORE REQUEST to write somebody's book/article/paper for them without compensation. That "somebody" was now curled up in the fetal position, her head resting on the spare tire, nylon cord cutting into the flesh of her wrists & ankles. The rain pounding on the car, the anxiety of the group, and the general lack of social skills all contributed to our irritable mood. "Pass that Nutella" came a voice from the back seat. "I vote for death by slow torture." [continued?] Simply Steve <nielsens@ccmail.orst.edu> wrote: I frequently post all sorts of total CRAP to this and other newsgroups. It is literally effortless!!! An ASDer wrote something along the lines of the following: Please indulge me one last time. I think I may be close to completely losing it. Right now I am doing all I can to stop myself from taking my own life. It is hard enough for me to remain calm and write this message, let alone to get through another day constantly pretending and put up with day-to-day tasks. This is not just me "ranting on as usual". Please don't send me "you're not thinking straight" type messages. Don't try to talk me out of this or help me get through it. I won't let my time be wasted by people's well-intentioned but utterly futile attempts to "talk sense" to me. Leah <Grydove@aol.com> responded with: I can't talk any sense into you, or try to talk you into or out of anything. I can't even do that for myself. You sound like you are in the same place I am. Either time to get locked up, or time to check out. Believe me, I'm hangin' by the same thin thread you are, and we both know there is nothing anybody here can really do about it. We can give you hugs and sincerely mean it, we can tell you to hang on another day and sincerely mean it, we can tell you we care and sincerely mean it, we can even tell you to get to a doctor (yesterday) for the meds/treatment you need. But, this is a support group. It only SUPPORTS the efforts that you and I are able to make on our own. I'm grateful for that support, cuz it's all I have at the moment. Nobody here can walk into your house, take your hand, and lead through each step of the day. (GOD I WISH SOMEONE COULD. FOR ME AND YOU BOTH!!!!) You and I are kinda teetering on a brink. It may be hospitalization for you, death for me. I don't know. Maybe both of us are at our bottoms now. Maybe hope will break through in some way tomorrow. I don't know. All I know is that this is the most painful, most unbearable time I've ever experienced in my life, and I think it probably is for you too. Is there any hope? Some people here say there is, but my stubborn gut tells me that I have further to fall before I see it. I don't know why. Maybe you're not as stubborn as I am. Maybe you can really scream out for help to the people and institutions and doctors and family and friends within your reach. Or maybe you will be stubborn like me and dig in a little deeper. I don't know. I think a lot about you. Been reading your posts since day one. What're we gonna do? Jennifer Taylor <jaltaylor@cix.compulink.co.uk> wrote: Hi, I need somewhere to open up. I've been depressed for 5 years (I'm 20). Next week will be my one year Prozac anniversary, and things were going fine. Until now that is. My ever-so-kind father has just come in and told me in no uncertain terms, that reading and writing about depression will only make matters worse. Depression is there for everyone, but the better members of society manage to avoid it, whereas we weak-willed and stupid individuals are just too self centered. We enjoy wallowing in our sorrows and being "different". It makes us feel important. "Depression's like hayfever" you just have to do things which won't make you depressed. I knew he didn't have a clue, but really. Sorry about that, I just wanted to get it out of my head. Does anyone else feel guilty about being on antidepressants - like you've sold out? Peter Roest <proest@mindspring.com> wrote: I suppose that, in a way, it's something of an accomplishment to be too screwed up for a support group, and I seem to have managed to do it. I don't want to do it, but I need to escape from ASD for a while. It's an overload problem. I don't seem to able keep an emotional distance from what I read. In light or moderate doses, it's OK. But too much of the same thing and the cumulative effect gets greater and greater. On some occasions, I have left ASD far more depressed than I was when I got on it. So many people with so much pain, and I can't do anything about it. I think about just skipping some of the rants and whines (neither of which is usually an accurate description) and Help! messages just to reduce the load, but I can't. If there's anything I think I can say that might conceivably be helpful, I have to try and say it. If I look back and find something wrong with what I said (and I always do), I feel like a miserable failure. If I can't think of anything to say, I skip the intermediate step and go directly to the failure part. This certainly is not the fault of anyone on ASD. Some of the nicest comments I have ever gotten have come from people on ASD. Brad <jbbell@niagara.com> wrote about what he called "The Howard Hughes State": The complete implosion of significance and meaning. The disappearance of any trace of will or desire. The disappearance of all affect, no emotions at all. My body is virtually paralyzed. I am a shuffling zombie at best. I do not eat or sleep. I am beyond being suicidal, I no longer care. I lay on my back in a dark room for days. I am an invisible corpse, dead but still breathing. I no longer exist at all. I will lie there until something happens. I know nothing will ever happen. It is always 3:14 am. Michael Dietsch <mdietsch@iquest.net> wrote in response to an "is anyone out there" post: I don't have a lot I can say that will help you right now, and that's actually why I'm writing. I read this newsgroup with some regularity, and I often see postings here that are just heart-wrenchingly sad. I don't really feel like I can help anyone much, and that makes me even sadder. So I shy away from offering advice, because I know that, well, a lot of my advice is just no good. But I wanted you to know that I saw your note, and that there is someone in cyberspace who cares how you are. EMC <ellenmc@hotmail.com> wrote: I am hoping that just writing this will make me feel better. I've always been the one who took care of everyone else's problems. The one who always listened and gave excellent advice. I am used to being needed, and have never felt that I needed anyone else. Now, when nobody needs me, I feel so remote, so alone, so disconnected. When someone needed me I had a purpose. I felt loved and connected. I guess my seeking out of needy people was in fact an avoidance of my own problems. Whenever I think I should seek counseling, I always feel guilty, like I should count my blessings instead of feeling down. I feel down, very down, and I don't enjoy anything that I do. I can't concentrate. Work is a joke, school is a joke. I've felt like this most of my life actually. I know I have so much potential, but can never seem to reach any goals. I hate being around people when I feel this way, I feel like I can't contribute to anyone or anything. I am going to call the campus medical center and get some help, but there are many things I've done that I'm ashamed of, and I am so afraid to talk to someone with whom I would have to share these things. I am terrified. Sick to my stomach, but also hopeful. Stewart/sna <sna@prophet.pharm.pitt.edu> responded with: This post helped me. However, ASD may not be a good place to come if you are mainly looking to feel good because you have helped others. On the other hand, IMHO, this is a great place to come if you are looking to help yourself, and if you want to feel that in the process of helping yourself you can also help others as well. At least that is how *I* feel about ASD. Tracy <lhime@okcity.tds.net> wrote: I will not be subscribing to this news group anymore. I came hear for a feeling of support. I have had very good responses from everyone, but there are new flame wars everyday. Name calling, bickering, and whatever. I'm leaving before I get flamed or sink even deeper into my own pit. My life is filled with hostility and anger in every aspect. I don't need it when I'm at home on my computer. Guess I'll just play solitaire from now on or something. To everyone who has given me support, made me laugh, and given me hope, I love you and I will miss you. Cindi James <Cindij@cris.com> wrote: I was thinking it might not be a bad idea to split up ASD. When I first started posting, there were only about 200 posts per day. Now, my server is showing like 500-600 posts per day. It's overwhelming! I want to keep reading/posting to ASD, but there are just too many posts. I don't have enough time to read them all, although I wish I could. What do you guys think about a split? No flames please, I'm just trying to figure out a feasible way to keep posting/reading ASD without going mad. Sue <matthews@digital.net> wrote: I need to post how hurt I feel by this thread. I am one of the "newbies" around here. I don't have any jokes, I've never tried nutella, and I don't write poetry. But that doesn't mean I don't enjoy those threads. It doesn't mean I can't laugh, vicariously enjoy nutella, or be deeply affected by a poem. I like the mix here on ASD. There is humor, pain, anger, and support. All of which I need to see at different times. To me, splitting up the group sounds something like: "Let's dump the newbies. They post the same boring stuff over and over again." I *know* this was never anyone's intention, but the feeling remains. I would hate to see ASD split into different groups. More than anything, I need a place to call home. A place where I can be accepted for who I am, depression and all. ASD (*all* of ASD) has been that place for me. Jim Schneider <jimsch@mint.net> wrote: It would be nice if someone would answer my cry for help. Sometimes (and I do understand) I feel this group is very self-centered. I want to laugh and tell jokes and live a productive life, but sometimes it's difficult and support is necessary. I wrote a similar letter months ago with the same gripe and though people eventually came around I'm starting to think it's me and not the group. Maybe I'm venting too much. After all, I do have a therapist to discuss these issues with. It's all right to tell me the truth, I'm not that fragile. Maybe I need attention and it's not fair to ask a group such as this to drop everything and say poor "poor Jim". Spider <anon-12390@anon.twwells.com> responded with: Welcome to ASD. Maybe this will help, maybe not?! Try to think of ASD as a large room. A *very* large room, with over 500 people coming and going every day. And every 3 seconds the door flies open and somebody walks in with a post like; "my wife is driving me crazy!" or "my effexor is pooping out again!" or "ya know, I REALLY hate myself today" or "Hi, I'm new here". Because we're human, we often respond most to the people we know. But new people might only get one or two people wandering by saying, "Hi, welcome to ASD. Come on in and stay awhile." Some newbies do come in and stay awhile. They post frequently, tell us about themselves, talk to us, and we get to know them pretty quickly and support them, and they support us. Other newbies come in once in a great while, and unfortunately, kind of STAY newbies. Yes, they may recognize US because they're standing outside watching thru the window (i.e., lurking), but since they only pop in the room every now and then, people haven't gotten the chance to get to KNOW them, or even recognize them! So the point of all this is, "I'm sorry, I don't recognize your name, so I don't recall seeing you here before. Stay awhile. Pull up a chair and let us get to know you. I'm sorry you're hurting. We all are hurting, and we all are sorry, and we all care. Welcome. John Underhay <junderha@peinet.pe.ca> wrote: Subject: Age Check Summary Stats Mean 33 Standard Deviation 11 Minimum 15 Maximum 67 Count 149 Editors note: This was just a summary snapshot in time of those who chose to respond with their ages. Jana <missg@mtco.com> wrote: I'm so excited!! I made it through this day, made it through the conflict with my ex with only a few brief thoughts of finding some way to end my miserable existence!! O.K., I know that sounds kind of contradictory, but that's the way I feel. I just love this place! (Of course, I'm really on a high right now, I'm sure I'll be crashing soon. Things don't go right very often without something bad slamming into me!!) The whole time I was with the ex, I kept thinking that I could always come back to my computer and RANT about my feelings. That is what kept me from actually doing any self-destructive things. Thank you all so much!! Even though I still want to DIE and just get it over with, you guys pulled me through another day. Now I'll get to spend Mother's Day listening to my parents gripe about how I never do anything right. Oh, well. I guess they'll learn someday!! Thanks again - I'm going to keep trying to hang on!! Veronica <veronica@compu.net> wrote: I'm new here (as you probably know). Been reading your posts for a couple of weeks. I think you people are the best (except the spammers and scammers). Anyway, my name is Veronica, I'm 46, and I just wanted to say "HI". When I get depressed it's awful because nobody wants to listen to me. It seems like I need the most love when I'm least lovable. Seems like I can help others when they are feeling depressed, yet I cannot help myself. Why is that? Tnardin <tnardin@aol.com> responded with: Maybe because you can identify with the feelings of a depressed person. That is good! It's not good that you are depressed. But since you are, this facet of your being makes you a valuable person to someone else who is suffering. Even when the depression has lifted, you will still have that keen sense of what a depressed person is feeling. Here is a newsgroup full of people who can relate to just about anything you can throw out. It's the benefit of a community. When there is no one in "real life" to talk to (probably the best thing is to do it in "real life", but that's not always possible), you can always come here. Just Me <andrewkl@cris.com> wrote: Subject: Re: An Open Message To (other) Newbies OK, so this is your first visit to A.S.D. Mine was just a few days ago, and it was made with a good deal of apprehension. Allow me a moment to put your minds at ease. I initially posted here simply to get some "stuff" out of my system, to unload, if you will. I suppose I didn't expect anything in return, other than the satisfaction of knowing that I had said what I wanted to say, and didn't place a burden on my friends or family, many of whom just don't care to listen (again). The response from the people at ASD has really been overwhelming, and, well, touching. Seem's that these folks CARE about you. They offer advise from personal experiences. they give you hugs and they give you support. At times, you even get a laugh thrown in for good measure. There are also some pretty scary experiences shared here, but that's part of recovery. So, to those of you that are "veterans" of ASD, I wish you God Speed for healthy, happy lives. For those of you just entering, don't be timid, don't be afraid. Say what you wanted to when you signed onto the group. This group really cares. E Jeep <anitan@community.net> wrote: Subject: Re: This is scary, but lets try... This is my first time posting, so please be patient. (Actually, my first posting anywhere!) I have suffered from severe depression for the last 20 years. Other than the initial occurrence, the worst episode was from Fall 95 to Winter 97. Starting to get better now, but "it" (depression/anxiety attacks/fatigue/ennui) still comes and goes. "It" is the whole reason I wanted to get on the net. There is no one whom I can talk to. Friends/family/spouse are uncomfortable with the topic, or give me newspaper clippings or spiritual advice. It all seems to come down to "put a smile on your face, tell yourself you're happy, and you'll believe it." I think their main view of depression is that I not do anything that would make the neighbors talk - I don't have to be happy, just act happy. So, is this the place where I can vent, wail, bitch, kvetch and kvell? Is there another group that I should be using? Am I doing this all wrong? I know these question sound stupid or frivolous. But I have tried posting here before when I was in the depths, and didn't know how to post or respond, or the proper way to do it. It's hell going through 30 minutes of newbie fumbling to try to reach *anybody* just to find out nothing happened, and you don't know how to make it work. And I can't ask my spouse to help me post to this site. Just let me know if this is a safe place to come when the shit hits. And if I promise not to blather anymore, can I respond to others when they feel crappy? It helps. The feeling of isolation is one of the worst parts of depression. And the isolation just feeds the depression. PitWithAVu <pitwithavu@prozac-moments.com> responded to someone who asked if this is the right group: If you're depressed, then you're in the right place. Welcome to our humble abode. There is no entrance exam, and there are no "correct" causative factors. There is no required level of depression. Once in you're in the pit, it ceases to be relative and becomes relevant. Waynsville <waynsville@aol.com> wrote: What do you do when your pdoc says "you should be happy?" John Timothy <johntim@ix.netcom.com> responded with: First you look right at him with the Clint Eastwood squint (with a hint of Nicholson in "The Shining" thrown in) for several seconds. Then say: "YOU...should be AFRAID....VERY afraid." Wait a few seonds more, then as fast as you can, JUMP up out of your chair and LUNGE at him, waving your arms, holding your eyes open really wide, and yelling "BLEAGH!!" at the top of your voice. Of course, this won't really *accomplish* anything...but it's a hell of a lot of fun! Good luck! Let me know how it works out for you. sara <yu150952@yorku.ca> wrote: I just had somewhat of a revelation. In therapy I was talking about how I've always envisioned myself as this romantic depressed character who broods alone, quietly, writing poetry, becoming one with the earth and the trees and the grass and the moon. My therapist asked what it is about depression that I think is so romantic. I talked about all the imagery that surrounds us in films and books and folklore, about these romantic brooding desperate woe-begone characters that has infiltrated my psyche. But I just thought of something else. It is so important for me to be good at things. At school, at playing instruments, at knowing idle bits of information. It has always been crucial that I excel, especially at school. I have never been an athlete and have never had the best social skills, and have always been tremendously shy. There are many things that I have wanted to be better at. So I hold those things that I *am* good at very close to me. They define me. So, yes, my revelation. Depression is something that I am GOOD at. I know how to brood, how to mope, how to pour out my heart. I have had lots of practice. I have had so much alone-time trying to get the attention of my parents, friends, lovers...desperate attempts to get noticed, so often in vain...that I am good at it. I don't succeed, but I am good in my attempts. I am damn good at being lost and desolate and abandoned. It's what I do best. The revelation is gone. I don't know what I mean anymore. It doesn't make sense to me as much anymore. This happens to me more and more these days...losing the thread of what I was thinking/saying. I'm convinced it's the meds. Either that or law school. So yes. I still believe in this myth of the romantic depressive. And she is me. And I'm still waiting to be rescued. But that's where the illusion is realized, where the myth falls apart. Because I can never be rescued from it. Not by anyone else. It has to be me that does the rescuing. And I don't know how long that will take. Nor if I can eve manage it. Skye <gullah@ix.netcom.com> wrote: Hi, asd'ers. I want to thank you for your posts and/or e-mails that got me through a rough day yesterday. It really helped me stay grounded in reality and go easier on myself for perfectly normal human reactions to what I was going through. This morning, I went out to get the newspaper and noticed the chirp of every bird, could swear I could see *every* blade of grass shimmering with dew...it seems life was telling me it was all there waiting for me if I but stopped and took it in. That means participating in life. The good and the bad. It means feelings are part of life, and because I accept that, I don't want to off myself anymore. I had felt my suicidal ideation was two great giant steps backward. Quite the contrary. It's a step forward into affirming my passion for life. I feel...therefore, I am. stacy <stacy@connix.com> wrote: I have started to think that I may be having feelings for another person. What happens now though is that every time they want to move to a higher level of closeness or intimacy, I start to back off. And I am *not* nice about it either. I think that being mean and hurtful is my way of protecting myself from eventually being hurt myself. This is becoming all to common of a behavior of mine. I am missing out on experiencing many people because of this. I work on it and work on it to no avail. This is what will keep me alone. Part of me feels unworthy of someone's love. Part of me feels that I will only ruin it eventually so why try? What is the matter with me? Why if I want not to be alone am I always setting myself up for it? BGumm <bgumm@aol.com> wrote: How do you handle not feeling anything at all?? Life is just a big gray haze that seems to never end. And my emotions and feelings are dead just as I feel dead. I am dealing with to many memories and to much pain. How do you folks handle the feeling of being dead to anything except pain and anger?? I am on meds and am in counseling. Not sure how far it is going to get me though.
